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Income Stream at Retirement

Last post 07-08-2008 5:27 PM by scottb. 3 replies.
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  • 07-03-2008 6:08 AM

    • Barney
    • Top 50 Contributor
    • Joined on 09-10-2007
    • Posts 9

    Income Stream at Retirement

    Hi Scott-

    Could you please offer some advice and/or reading references on the most financially beneficial way of creating an income stream during retirement?  I will be 62 in 2 years, and eligible for about $1,600/mo in SS.  My wife is 50 and disabled, and already receiving about $1,400/mo in SS payments.  I am receiving a military pension of $2,600/mo, and am eligible to receive a private pension (not inflation adjusted) when I choose, worth around $870/mo now, but worth $1,300 a month if I wait until I am 65yo.  Also, I have a traditional IRA portfolio that is valued at $420K today, and some series EE bonds of $30K.

    With our house paid off, no debt and $100K in a MMF as an emergency fund, we can live comfortably on an after tax income of $60K/year.  I am perplexed about when to start SS and my private pension, when to begin 401 (k) disributions, and when to cash out of the bonds.  I think I should try to preserve capital and minimize what I give to uncle Sam.

    Your thoughts and recommended reading would be highly appreciated.

    Barney

  • 07-03-2008 5:24 PM In reply to

    Re: Income Stream at Retirement

    Barney,

    You are surrounded by very good choices and options. So I think the first thing you should do is shed any financially-induced anxiety you're carrying around. You're pretty well covered and you'd have to work pretty hard to make yourself into a disaster. I wish more people were in your position.

    Fact 1: Whatever decision you make, you've got your basic security nut covered. With a need for $5,000 a month in after-tax income, you'll have a gross income of at least $6,470 a month without counting your investment income. Your income tax obligations won't come close to your $1,470 a month surplus.

    Fact 2: By delaying taking Social Security until you are at least full retirement age you'll be able to increase your inflation adjusted income from Social Security substantially--- and you've got enough in your IRA that it will be relatively painless. Better still, every dollar of IRA money you use to defer taking SS benefits is another investment dollar you don't have to worry about. And since your IRA is worth $420,000 today, taking $19,600 a year from it for, say, 4 years won't diminish it much, if at all, anyway.

    Fact 3: By delaying taking your private pension you can also increase it quite painlessly. Again, you'll do this by taking the needed income from your IRA account. Remember, since your lowest estimate of your guaranteed pension incomes covers your cost of living and taxes, you can go this with great freedom.

    Fact 4: With virtually no effort you can raise the return on your $100k reserve fund--- and perhaps lower your tax liabilities at the same time. With a current and guaranteed income that covers all your living expenses, you really don't need much of a reserve fund. You certainly don't need more than a year of spending in reserve. I suggest keeping $30,000 in cash reserves and investing the remaining $70,000 in assets that provide higher returns. If they were invested index funds, for instance, your return would likely increase (current market notwithstanding) and you would be deferring most tax liabilities.

    Fact 5: With a future gross income of about $7,300 a month (assuming deferring pensions) plus some investment income from your IRA, you and your wife should start thinking about what you might do with a sustainable income greater than $5,000 a month after taxes.

    Scott

     

  • 07-06-2008 1:30 PM In reply to

    Re: Income Stream at Retirement

    Scott:

    My situation is somewhat similar to Barney's (altho I'm not as well off).  My wife and I can live off of our pension and SocSec money when we retire in a couple of years, so I was considering (mulling it over) using the new Vanguard Managed Payout Funds for a portion of our portfolio to create an income stream.  I noticed that the Vanguard funds reviewer on Morningstar said to give them a couple of years to see how they do, and I have seen the Distribution Focus fund (VPDFX) criticized elsewhere in that they didn't think the fund could keep up the 7%/year without eating into the principal (Distribution Focus is supposed to pay out about 7%/year while maintaining the principal balance; Growth & Distr is designed to pay out 5%/yr, and have moderate growth potential for the principal; and Growth Focus is designed for 3%/yr payout with more growth of principal.).  I like the idea that we can liquidate the principal, when/if we want, and I like the aspect of the diversification of the asset classes (apparently similar to the large university endowments, e.g. Yale).  It would seem to do the job I "might" do, if I devoted enough time to "porfolio manangement" (which I won't).   I was looking at buying all three ($25K each, minimum) and setting it up so the Growth Focus and Growth and Distribution Focus both paid into buying additional shares of the Distribution Focus.  The only part that gives me some pause is that (like the university endowments) the Vanguard funds "may" use, as one possible strategy, the types of investments that got those smart guys at Long Term Capital Management into trouble (if I'm reading the prospectus correctly).

    So, is this a couch potato's dream, or risky business?  What do you think? 

    Many thanks.   

  • 07-08-2008 5:27 PM In reply to

    Re: Income Stream at Retirement

    Charles,

    That 7 percent figure makes me nervous. That's the figure Peter Lynch used long ago in an article where he said you could be 100 percent invested in equities and safely take 7 percent a year. I showed that he was dead wrong in this column, "Dangerous Advice from Peter Lynch": http://assetbuilder.com/blogs/scott_burns/archive/1995/10/01/Dangerous-Advice-from-Peter-Lynch-.aspx 

    That column was followed by this one examining the importance of dividend yields: http://assetbuilder.com/blogs/scott_burns/archive/1995/10/03/What-A-Difference-A-Year-Makes-.aspx

    and this column seeking an withdrawal rate that would work, "Making the Lynch All-Stock Strategy Work: http://assetbuilder.com/blogs/scott_burns/archive/1995/10/08/Making-the-Lynch-All_2D00_Stock-Strategy-Work.aspx

     Those columns are now 13 years old--- ancient history--- and scads of research has been done examining portfolio survival and withdrawal rates. Now that millions of people are heading for retirement--- and turning their accumulating portfolios into distributing portfolios--- managing withdrawals has become question #1. Still, visit a website like www.firecalc.com and you'll see that having a 7 percent withdrawal rate materially reduces the survival odds for your portfolio.

    Scott

     

     

     

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